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Loading Status...Parkour: Mana from building.
- Thread starter Zim
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I think if this were to be implemented, an amount of mana received per accepted map would make a lot more sense than a block-by-block thing (how would that even work anyway?) People build at very different speeds, so someone who is copying a build from a singleplayer world would get a different amount of mana than someone who is building from scratch in the plot. Also, not everything that is built is submitted, let alone accepted - you're not contributing to the server with a rejected map. Getting say 500 mana when your map is added to /warp beta makes a lot more sense.
However, I don't back this idea. Building should not be a means of gaining mana. Knowing that your map is being played by hundreds of strangers is more than enough incentive, and the Mapper role is an added bonus.
However, I don't back this idea. Building should not be a means of gaining mana. Knowing that your map is being played by hundreds of strangers is more than enough incentive, and the Mapper role is an added bonus.
You said (in other words): "Mana should not be incentive for building".
I think that a block by block xp like incentive would add an additional rewarding system that would make building feel similarly rewarding as the parkour, making more people want to create builds, even if just for fun. This is the spirit that parkour has. The logic is, I want building to be more similar to the parkour, In parkour, you get a mana incentive every 1-5 minutes or so (or a bigger one for harder maps). And it makes building feel a bit emptier and less worth doing than parkour does to the average joe. I'll say it again with less detail: I want the incentivized process of building to be more similar to the process of doing parkour. Cause right now I sense a pretty significant imbalance.
You said: You're not contributing to the server with a rejected map. My answer: Like in parkour, where it is the process of doing parkour, not the result; it is about refining the process of building, which is what I think is lacking. Not the result; seeing thousands of people use it and eventually becoming a mapper.
You asked; how to make this work? Well. I don't need to answer this, as the devs are probably more equipped than I to do so, but this would be one of the methods of implementing it I can think might work:
Make it so the server checks every half an hour or longer, sees how many blocks have been added to the plot, and then adds a very miniscule amount of mana for the time spent. Mana incentive would not be much, but it would make the parkour and building worlds blend more in feel, which I think would be better.
Exploiting.
The only way I see this way of earning mana would be exploited would be if somebody used a massive number of hacked clients to automatically fly around placing blocks indefinitely, with a randomized pattern, with certain time gaps between sessions of placing blocks.
But then again, we could have people making parkour bots that know how to go through all the parkours too. It would just be a little harder for people who make hacked clients, making it less likely to happen. I think that if people ended up logging in with 20 bot accounts with VPNS and started randomly placing blocks without making a coherent parkour, we would figure out about how to deal with it by then. But I don't think the community is big enough for this to be a widespread method. At that point, that amount of effort for earning a passive income would be commendable, really. And we could always turn the reward system off at that point if there was no easy answer. But I still think it would be worth a shot.
Lag problems.
If a bot that checks every half an hour or hour takes too much capacity or makes lag happen at random intervals, then either find a smoother coding solution or give up cause it's not worth it.
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Okay what is the point of earning mana on Parkour without even doing parkour ? If you wanna earn mana from building, you can just go play on /creative. There is already Mapper rank that give a reward for players that build parkour maps, but if we need to add more rewards, giving mana as a reward would be kinda stupid. The only way I see is getting a bit of mana per accepted maps, but nothing else. It's a Parkour server, not a Creative server, what is the point of griding mana on Parkour if someone can also grind without even playing ? (/vote and scrambers is already enough)
I'm pretty much with Shinx and Tas on this one. As someone who builds most of the time in Parkour anyway, I feel like earning mana through building defeats the point of doing parkour on a Parkour server. I build a LOT, and I wouldn't want building to be incentivized by blocks placed, especially when most of the time I use WorldEdit to make most of my larger structures and texture by hand. That's a LOT of blocks that I "wouldn't get credit for". I think a lot of people use WorldEdit to make their maps. It would be both difficult to track by blocks placed because of WorldEdit, and pretty unnecessary, considering rewards such as Mapper and the Map of the Month Featured tag or mana reward exist.
[QUOTE="Shinxray : Okay what is the point of earning mana on Parkour without even doing parkour ? If you wanna earn mana from building, you can just go play on /creative. There is already Mapper rank that give a reward for players that build parkour maps, but if we need to add more rewards, giving mana as a reward would be kinda stupid. The only way I see is getting a bit of mana per accepted maps, but nothing else. It's a Parkour server, not a Creative server, what is the point of griding mana on Parkour if someone can also grind without even playing ? (/vote and scrambers is already enough)"[/QUOTE]
Thanks for consideration so far!
I agree. If the points were only given to parkourists then people would be certain they got it from parkour.
However, I still have the feeling I explained earlier (Being 30 hours into a build with no new rank or recognition). Perhaps we could provide a builder currency and builder rankups instead, providing their own tree of recognition. If done right it might not be as messy as it sounds.
Cleaning up the idea a little. The ranks either overlay each other, or one could choose which one to show. And if u hovered over the name, you could still see his "builder rank". Maybe the builder rank would only see through hovering.
What would you think about a builder currency incentive for builders as an idea?
Also, worldedit definitely changes things up here. I didn't know that was widely available. It would certainly save time on my build right now. It would be very hard to use without needing to make the entire world just a passive income farm. But perhaps that's actually reliable if it's not mana we're talking about. But I agree it feels pretty inconsistent even then.. I wonder if there are better solutions.
Again. Thanks for any consideration nonetheless and my newly made, granted less refined proposal still stands to be thought about.
Thanks for consideration so far!
I agree. If the points were only given to parkourists then people would be certain they got it from parkour.
However, I still have the feeling I explained earlier (Being 30 hours into a build with no new rank or recognition). Perhaps we could provide a builder currency and builder rankups instead, providing their own tree of recognition. If done right it might not be as messy as it sounds.
Cleaning up the idea a little. The ranks either overlay each other, or one could choose which one to show. And if u hovered over the name, you could still see his "builder rank". Maybe the builder rank would only see through hovering.
What would you think about a builder currency incentive for builders as an idea?
Also, worldedit definitely changes things up here. I didn't know that was widely available. It would certainly save time on my build right now. It would be very hard to use without needing to make the entire world just a passive income farm. But perhaps that's actually reliable if it's not mana we're talking about. But I agree it feels pretty inconsistent even then.. I wonder if there are better solutions.
Again. Thanks for any consideration nonetheless and my newly made, granted less refined proposal still stands to be thought about.[/QUOTE]
I still don’t understand why you want some kind of time-based reward system and not just per map submitted (the latter which already exists by the way: the Mapper rank)
A system based on time build or blocks placed seems easily exploitable. If you were to nerf the amount of mana gained by this method to the point where it wasn’t worth exploiting, the amount of mana gained by people using the system legitimately would be negligible.
What if we gave new mappers a large initial reward for getting their first map accepted, and quickly lessened the reward for each new one? When I started making maps, 3 maps for mapper rank felt really far away given how much time I spent on my first map. It still felt like I had to put in at least a couple hours of work when I only needed one more map accepted. Maybe a more immediate reward could encourage more to get into mapping.
Only problem is that it would also bring a lot of poorly built maps into submission and shinx would have more stuff to keep track of :/
What if we gave new mappers a large initial reward for getting their first map accepted, and quickly lessened the reward for each new one? When I started making maps, 3 maps for mapper rank felt really far away given how much time I spent on my first map. It still felt like I had to put in at least a couple hours of work when I only needed one more map accepted. Maybe a more immediate reward could encourage more to get into mapping.
Only problem is that it would also bring a lot of poorly built maps into submission and shinx would have more stuff to keep track of :/
I think the idea of the incentive is good to have in the air at least. There's gotta be a good way of doing it, and the way you proposed seems pretty solid too. Earlier I suggested we get a specific, less prominent currency for building, which unlocks ranks or just an additional name-hover word depending on how much building one has done. I think that would be the way to go.
And yeah, having poorly made maps in the submissions would be problematic.
And yeah, having poorly made maps in the submissions would be problematic.